FAIR is a non-profit organization dedicated to providing well-documented answers to criticisms of the doctrine, practice, and history of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Difference between revisions of "Mormonism and Wikipedia/Golden plates/Composition and weight"
m (Bot: Automated text replacement (-{{Articles(.*)}} +)) |
m (Bot: Automated text replacement (-{{WikipediaPassage\n\|claim= +{{IndexClaimItemShort\n|title={{check}}\n|claim=)) |
||
| Line 23: | Line 23: | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
The plates were first described as "gold", and beginning about 1827, the plates were widely called the "gold bible". | The plates were first described as "gold", and beginning about 1827, the plates were widely called the "gold bible". | ||
| Line 32: | Line 33: | ||
}} | }} | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
When the Book of Mormon was published in 1830, the [[Eight Witnesses]] described the plates as having "the appearance of gold". | When the Book of Mormon was published in 1830, the [[Eight Witnesses]] described the plates as having "the appearance of gold". | ||
| Line 42: | Line 44: | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
The Book of Mormon describes the plates as being made of "ore". | The Book of Mormon describes the plates as being made of "ore". | ||
| Line 55: | Line 58: | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
In 1831, a Palmyra newspaper quoted [[David Whitmer]], one of the [[Three Witnesses]], as having said that the plates were a "''whitish yellow'' color", with "three small rings of the same metal". | In 1831, a Palmyra newspaper quoted [[David Whitmer]], one of the [[Three Witnesses]], as having said that the plates were a "''whitish yellow'' color", with "three small rings of the same metal". | ||
| Line 64: | Line 68: | ||
}} | }} | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
[[Joseph Smith, Jr.]]'s first published description of the plates said that the plates "had the appearance of gold" | [[Joseph Smith, Jr.]]'s first published description of the plates said that the plates "had the appearance of gold" | ||
| Line 73: | Line 78: | ||
}} | }} | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
But Smith said that Moroni had referred to the plates as "gold." Late in life, [[Martin Harris (Latter Day Saints)|Martin Harris]] stated that the rings holding the plates together were made of silver, | But Smith said that Moroni had referred to the plates as "gold." Late in life, [[Martin Harris (Latter Day Saints)|Martin Harris]] stated that the rings holding the plates together were made of silver, | ||
| Line 83: | Line 89: | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
and he said the plates themselves, based on their heft of "forty or fifty pounds" (18–23 kg), | and he said the plates themselves, based on their heft of "forty or fifty pounds" (18–23 kg), | ||
| Line 92: | Line 99: | ||
}} | }} | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
"were lead or gold". | "were lead or gold". | ||
| Line 106: | Line 114: | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
Joseph's brother [[William Smith (Latter Day Saints)|William Smith]], who said he felt the plates inside a pillow case in 1827, said in 1884 that he understood the plates to be "a mixture of gold and copper...much heavier than stone, and very much heavier than wood". | Joseph's brother [[William Smith (Latter Day Saints)|William Smith]], who said he felt the plates inside a pillow case in 1827, said in 1884 that he understood the plates to be "a mixture of gold and copper...much heavier than stone, and very much heavier than wood". | ||
| Line 119: | Line 128: | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
Different people estimated the weight of the plates differently. According to Smith's one-time-friend Willard Chase, Smith told him in 1827 that the plates weighed between 40 and 60 pounds (18–27 kg), most likely the latter. | Different people estimated the weight of the plates differently. According to Smith's one-time-friend Willard Chase, Smith told him in 1827 that the plates weighed between 40 and 60 pounds (18–27 kg), most likely the latter. | ||
| Line 129: | Line 139: | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
Smith's father [[Joseph Smith, Sr.]], who was one of the [[Eight Witnesses]], reportedly weighed them and said in 1830 that they "weighed thirty pounds" (14 kg). | Smith's father [[Joseph Smith, Sr.]], who was one of the [[Eight Witnesses]], reportedly weighed them and said in 1830 that they "weighed thirty pounds" (14 kg). | ||
| Line 139: | Line 150: | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
Joseph Smith's brother, William, said that he lifted them in a pillowcase and thought they "weighed about sixty pounds [27 kg] according to the best of my judgment". | Joseph Smith's brother, William, said that he lifted them in a pillowcase and thought they "weighed about sixty pounds [27 kg] according to the best of my judgment". | ||
| Line 149: | Line 161: | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
Others who lifted the plates while they were wrapped in cloth or enclosed in a box thought that they weighed about 60 pounds [27 kg]. Martin Harris said that he had "hefted the plates many times, and should think they weighed forty or fifty pounds [18–23 kg]". | Others who lifted the plates while they were wrapped in cloth or enclosed in a box thought that they weighed about 60 pounds [27 kg]. Martin Harris said that he had "hefted the plates many times, and should think they weighed forty or fifty pounds [18–23 kg]". | ||
| Line 158: | Line 171: | ||
}} | }} | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
Joseph Smith's wife [[Emma Hale Smith|Emma]] never estimated the weight of the plates but said they were light enough for her to "move them from place to place on the table, as it was necessary in doing my work". | Joseph Smith's wife [[Emma Hale Smith|Emma]] never estimated the weight of the plates but said they were light enough for her to "move them from place to place on the table, as it was necessary in doing my work". | ||
| Line 171: | Line 185: | ||
}} | }} | ||
===== ===== | ===== ===== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title={{check}} | ||
|claim= | |claim= | ||
None of the witnesses specified the exact size of the plates or the number of leaves contained in them, but one scholar speculates that, had the plates been made of 24-karat gold (which Smith never claimed), they would have weighed about 140 pounds (64 kg). | None of the witnesses specified the exact size of the plates or the number of leaves contained in them, but one scholar speculates that, had the plates been made of 24-karat gold (which Smith never claimed), they would have weighed about 140 pounds (64 kg). | ||
Revision as of 13:23, 10 August 2017
FAIR Answers—back to home page
| Described format, binding, and dimensions | A FairMormon Analysis of Wikipedia: Mormonism and Wikipedia/Golden plates A work by a collaboration of authors (Link to Wikipedia article here)
|
"Sealed" portion |
| The name Wikipedia® is a registered trademark of the Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.. Wikipedia content is copied and made available under the GNU Free Documentation License. |
An analysis of the Wikipedia article "Golden plates" Updated 9/21/2011
Reviews of previous revisions of this section
December 2009
Summary: A review of this section as it appeared in Wikipedia in December 2009.Section review
Described composition and weight
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
The plates were first described as "gold", and beginning about 1827, the plates were widely called the "gold bible".Author's sources: *Harris (1859) , p. 167; Smith (1853) , pp. 102, 109, 113, 145; Grandin (1829) .
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
When the Book of Mormon was published in 1830, the Eight Witnesses described the plates as having "the appearance of gold".Author's sources: *Smith (1830)
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
The Book of Mormon describes the plates as being made of "ore".Author's sources: *Smith (1830) .
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
In 1831, a Palmyra newspaper quoted David Whitmer, one of the Three Witnesses, as having said that the plates were a "whitish yellow color", with "three small rings of the same metal".Author's sources: *Cole (1831)
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
Joseph Smith, Jr.'s first published description of the plates said that the plates "had the appearance of gold"Author's sources: *Smith (1842)
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
But Smith said that Moroni had referred to the plates as "gold." Late in life, Martin Harris stated that the rings holding the plates together were made of silver,Author's sources: *Joseph Smith History 1:34; Harris (1859) , p. 165.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
and he said the plates themselves, based on their heft of "forty or fifty pounds" (18–23 kg),Author's sources: *Harris (1859) , p. 166
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
"were lead or gold".Author's sources: *Harris (1859) , p. 169.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
Joseph's brother William Smith, who said he felt the plates inside a pillow case in 1827, said in 1884 that he understood the plates to be "a mixture of gold and copper...much heavier than stone, and very much heavier than wood".Author's sources: *Smith (1884)
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
Different people estimated the weight of the plates differently. According to Smith's one-time-friend Willard Chase, Smith told him in 1827 that the plates weighed between 40 and 60 pounds (18–27 kg), most likely the latter.Author's sources: *Chase (1833) , p. 246.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
Smith's father Joseph Smith, Sr., who was one of the Eight Witnesses, reportedly weighed them and said in 1830 that they "weighed thirty pounds" (14 kg).Author's sources: *Lapham (1870) .
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
Joseph Smith's brother, William, said that he lifted them in a pillowcase and thought they "weighed about sixty pounds [27 kg] according to the best of my judgment".Author's sources: *Smith (1883) .
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
Others who lifted the plates while they were wrapped in cloth or enclosed in a box thought that they weighed about 60 pounds [27 kg]. Martin Harris said that he had "hefted the plates many times, and should think they weighed forty or fifty pounds [18–23 kg]".Author's sources: *Harris (1859) , pp. 166, 169.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
Joseph Smith's wife Emma never estimated the weight of the plates but said they were light enough for her to "move them from place to place on the table, as it was necessary in doing my work".Author's sources: *Smith (1879)
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Check link or content make(s) the following claim:
None of the witnesses specified the exact size of the plates or the number of leaves contained in them, but one scholar speculates that, had the plates been made of 24-karat gold (which Smith never claimed), they would have weighed about 140 pounds (64 kg).Author's sources: *Vogel (2004) .
FAIR's Response
References
| Wikipedia references for "Golden Plates" |
- Anthon, Charles, Howe, Eber Dudley (editor) Mormonism Unvailed: or, A Faithful Account of That Singular Imposition and Delusion, from Its Rise to the Present Time , Painesville, Ohio: Telegraph Press off-site .
- Bennett, James Gordon, Jr., Mormon Leaders at Their Mecca off-site .
- Bennett, James Gordon, Sr., Arrington, Leonard J. (editor) (1831), James Gordon Bennett's 1831 Report on 'The Mormonites' off-site .
- Benton, Abram W., Vogel, Dan (editor) Early Mormon Documents Signature Books .
- Bidamon, Emma Smith, Early Mormon Documents Signature Books .
- Burnett, David S., Something New.—Golden Bible off-site .
- Burnett, Stephen, Vogel, Dan (editor) (1838), Early Mormon Documents Signature Books .
- Bushman, Richard Lyman, (2005), Joseph Smith: Rough Stone Rolling , New York: Knopf .
- Chase, Willard, Howe, Eber Dudley (editor) (1833), Mormonism Unvailed , Painesville, Ohio: Telegraph Press off-site .
- Clark, John A., (1842), Gleanings by the Way , Philadelphia: W.J. & J.K. Simmon off-site .
- Cobb, James T., The Hill Cumorah, And The Book Of Mormon. The Smith Family, Cowdery, Harris, and Other Old Neighbors—What They Know off-site .
- Cole, Abner, Gold Bible, No. 6 off-site .
- Cook, Lyndon W., (1991), David Whitmer Interviews: A Restoration Witness Grandin .
- Cowdery, Oliver, (1834), Letter [I] off-site .
- Cowdery, Oliver, (1834b), Letter III off-site .
- Cowdery, Oliver, (1835a), Letter IV off-site .
- Cowdery, Oliver, (1835b), Letter VIII off-site .
- Crystal, David, (1997), The Cambridge Encyclopedia of Language Cambridge University Press .
- (1996), The World's Writing Systems Oxford University Press .
- Gilbert, John H., (1892), Recollections of John H. Gilbert , Palmyra, New York: typescript located in Harold B. Lee Library, Brigham Young University off-site .
- Givens, Terryl L., (2003), By the Hand of Mormon: The American Scripture that Launched a New World Religion Oxford University Press .
- Grandin, E.B., Editor's note off-site .
- Hadley, Jonathan A., Golden Bible off-site .
- Hale, Isaac, Howe, Eber Dudley (editor) (1834), Mormonism Unvailed , Painesville, Ohio: Telegraph Press off-site .
- Hamblin, William J., (2007), Sacred Writing on Metal Plates in the Ancient Mediterranean off-site .
- Harris, Abigail, Howe, Eber Dudley (editor) (1833), Mormonism Unvailed , Painesville, Ohio: Telegraph Press off-site .
- Harris, Henry, Howe, Eber Dudley (editor) (1833), Mormonism Unvailed , Painesville, Ohio: Telegraph Press off-site .
- Harris, Martin, (1859), Mormonism, No. II off-site .
- Howe, Eber Dudley, (1834), Mormonism Unvailed Painesville, Ohio: Telegraph Press off-site .
- Knight, Joseph, Sr., Jessee, Dean (editor) (1833), Joseph Knight's Recollection of Early Mormon History off-site .
- Lapham, [La]Fayette, (1870), Interview with the Father of Joseph Smith, the Mormon Prophet, Forty years Ago. His Account of the Finding of the Sacred Plates off-site .
- Mormon History off-site .
- Mather, Frederic G., (1880), Early Days of Mormonism off-site .
- Metcalfe, Brent Lee, (1993), Apologetic and Critical Assumptions about Book of Mormon Historicity off-site .
- Packer, J. Cameron, (2004), Cumorah's Cave Maxwell Institute off-site .
- Palmer, Grant H., (2002), An Insider's View of Mormon Origins Signature Books .
- Parrish, Warren, (1838), Letter from W. Parrish, Kirtland The Evangelist off-site , republished in Vogel, Dan (editor) (1999), Early Mormon Documents , Salt Lake City: Signature Books .
- Phelps, , (1833), A Book of Commandments, for the Government of the Church of Christ Zion: William Wines Phelps & Co. off-site .
- Poulson, P. Wilhelm, Letter to the editor. .
- Pratt, Orson, (1856), The Faith and Visions of the Ancient Saints—The Same Great Blessing to be Enjoyed by the Latter-day Saints off-site .
- Pratt, Orson, (1859), Evidences of the Bible and Book of Mormon Compared off-site .
- Pratt, Orson, (1877), King Limhi's Enquiry, from the Book of Mormon' off-site .
- Putnam, Read H., Were the Golden Plates Made of Tumbaga? off-site .
- Quinn, D. Michael, (1998), Early Mormonism and the Magic World View , Salt Lake City: Signature Books .
- Riley, I. Woodbridge, (1903), The Founder of Mormonism: A Psychological Study of Joseph Smith, Jr. , New York: Dodd, Mead & Co. off-site
- Roberts, B. H. (editor) (1902), History of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints , Salt Lake City: Deseret News off-site .
- Roberts, B. H. (editor) (1905), History of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints , Salt Lake City: Deseret News off-site .
- Roberts, B. H. (editor) (1908), History of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints , Salt Lake City: Deseret News off-site .
- Robinson, Andrew, (2002), Lost Languages: The Enigma of the World's Undeciphered Scripts McGraw Hill .
- Salisbury, Katharine Smith, Walker, Kyle R. (editor) Katharine Smith Salisbury's Recollections of Joseph's Meetings with Moroni off-site .
- Saunders, Benjamin, Vogel, Dan (editor) (1884a), Early Mormon Documents , Salt Lake City: Signature Books .
- Saunders, Lorenzo, Vogel, Dan (editor) (1884b), Early Mormon Documents , Salt Lake City: Signature Books .
- Saunders, Orson, Bennett, James Gordon, Jr. (editor) Mormon Leaders at Their Mecca off-site .
- Smith, Joseph III, last Testimony of Sister Emma off-site .
- Smith, Joseph, Jr., (1830), The Book of Mormon: An Account Written by the Hand of Mormon, Upon Plates Taken from the Plates of Nephi , Palmyra, New York: E. B. Grandin off-site .
- Smith, Joseph, Jr., Jessee, Dean C (editor) (1832), Personal Writings of Joseph Smith , Salt Lake City: Deseret Book off-site .
- (1835), Doctrine and Covenants of the Church of the Latter Day Saints: Carefully Selected from the Revelations of God , Kirtland, Ohio: F. G. Williams & Co off-site .
- Smith, Joseph, Jr., (1838a), History of the Church , copied to Jessee, Dean C (editor) (1839–1843), Personal Writings of Joseph Smith Deseret Book .
- Smith, Joseph, Jr., (1838b), Editor's note off-site .
- Smith, Joseph, Jr., Church History [Wentworth Letter] , Nauvoo, Illinois: off-site .
- Smith, Joseph, Sr., To the Public off-site .
- Smith, Lucy Mack, Casawall, Henry (editor) (1842b), The City of the Mormons; or, Three Days at Nauvoo, in 1842 , London: J.G.F. & J. Rivington off-site .
- Smith, Lucy Mack, (1853), Biographical Sketches of Joseph Smith the Prophet, and His Progenitors for Many Generations Liverpool: S.W. Richards off-site .
- Smith, William, (1883), William Smith on Mormonism: A True Account of the Origin of the Book of Mormon' Lamoni, Iowa: RLDS Church off-site .
- Smith, William, (1884), The Old Soldier's Testimony off-site .
- Stevenson, Edward, (1882), One of the Three Witnesses: Incidents in the Life of Martin Harris off-site .
- Storey, Wilbur F., Interview with David Whitmer off-site .
- Tvedtnes, John A, (1990), Review of Little Known Evidences of the Book of Mormon by Brenton G. Yorgason Maxwell Institute off-site .
- Tucker, Pomeroy, (1867), Origin, Rise and Progress of Mormonism , New York: D. Appleton off-site .
- Turner, Orasmus, (1851), History of the Pioneer Settlement of Phelps and Gorham's Purchase, and Morris' Reserve , Rochester, New York: William Alling off-site .
- Wade, B., An Interesting Document off-site .
- {{{title}}} .
- Walker, Ronald W., (1986), Martin Harris: Mormonism's Early Convert off-site .
- Whitmer, , The Golden Tables off-site .
- Whitmer, David, (1887), An Address to All Believers in Christ By A Witness to the Divine Authenticity of the Book of Mormon' , Richmond, Missouri: David Whitmer off-site .
- Whitmer, David, An Old Mormon's Closing Hours: David Whitmer, One of the Pioneers of That Faith, Passing Away off-site .
- Williams, Stephen, (1991), Fantastic Archaeology: The Wild Side of North American Prehistory University of Pennsylvania Press .
- Woodard, Roger D. (editor) (2004), The Cambridge Encyclopedia of the World's Ancient Languages Cambridge University Press .
- Young, Brigham, Watt, G.D. (editor) Journal of Discourses by Brigham Young, President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, His Two Counsellors, the Twelve Apostles, and Others , Liverpool: F.D. & S.W. Richards off-site .
- Young, Brigham, Journal of Discourses by Brigham Young, His Two Counselors, and the Twelve Apostles , Liverpool: William Budge .
Further reading
Copyright © 2005–2024 FAIR. This is not an official Web site of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. The content of this page may not be copied, published, or redistributed without the prior written consent of FAIR.
| We welcome your suggestions for improving the content of this FAIR Wiki article. |
Sites we recommend: |