• Skip to primary navigation
  • Skip to main content
  • Skip to primary sidebar
  • Skip to footer

FairMormon

Subscribe To Our Newsletter

Come, Follow Me Resources

  • Find Answers
  • Blog
  • Media & Apps
  • Conference
  • Bookstore
  • Archive
  • About
  • Get Involved
  • Search

Mormon Fair-Cast 215: The First Vision

March 31, 2014 by Ned Scarisbrick

https://media.blubrry.com/mormonfaircast/p/www.fairlatterdaysaints.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/MHG-Number7-FirstVision.mp3

Podcast: Download (49.1MB)

Subscribe: RSS

RussellStevensonIt is the foundational event of Mormonism–or at least that is what it became. Beginning in 1832, Joseph Smith began to publicly talk about a visionary experience he had in a grove of trees nearby his home in upstate New York. However, what he told audiences differed from year-to-year in what feels to be substantial detail. Is this evidence of rank fraud? Or, as his supporters say, does it indicate the natural human tendency to emphasize/omit details of a story based on one’s audience or perhaps his own changing understanding of the importance of certain theological principles. Brittany Nielson and I speak with LDS Church Historian Dr. Stephen Harper about his book, Joseph Smith’s First Vision: A Guide to the Historical Accounts.  Harper currently works on the Joseph Smith Papers Project production team for the LDS Church.

This podcast interview was provided courtesy of Russell Stevenson.

Russell Stevenson is the “Mormon History Guy” and the views expressed are his own may not reflect those of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints or that of FairMormon.

Filed Under: Anti-Mormon critics, Apologetics, Book reviews, Doctrine, Evidences, Faith Crisis, First Vision, General, Hosts, Joseph Smith, Mormon Voices, Ned Scarisbrick, Podcast, Power of Testimony

Reader Interactions

Comments

  1. whitethunder says

    April 2, 2014 at 9:19 am

    Dr. Harper, thanks for doing this podcast. I’m curious how you respond to the accounts of both William Smith and Oliver Cowdery who both specifically mention that Rev. Lane gave a sermon that motivated JS to ask which church he should join. William is even so specific as to mention that the sermon was “what church shall I join?”, wherein he recommends that his audience use James 1:5 as a method to decide. The problem is that if these accounts are to be believed, then JS more than likely did not hear this sermon until the latter part of 1824 at the earliest, which entirely upsets the narrative of the First Vision as I’m sure you will recognize.

  2. JTurn says

    April 5, 2014 at 8:45 pm

    When a historian tells you up front that he is going to be objective – that he is about to tell you he truth – I agree one should approach his work with skepticism. So it goes for Grant Palmer, and so it goes for Nephi (1 Nephi 1:3).

    When a historian goes even further – in my mind and appeals to an exclusive supernatural epistemology (e.g. a “very Mormon epistemology”) I grow even more skeptical. I wonder whether he can offer anything more than faith-preserving possibilities where more probable reconstructions are warranted.

    And when the same historian also admits he is more interested in “the subjectivity of history than the objectivity of it” … well, I simply don’t know what to make of that. Honestly.

  3. JTurn says

    April 8, 2014 at 8:55 am

    I see no evidential grounds for Professor Harper claiming that Joseph was “probably” referring to two separate divine beings in the 1832 account [1]

    Read the whole text. “Lord” refers to the “crucifyed” Jesus. Any alternative interpretation pushes beyond a plain reading of the text and merely a forced harmonization. Talk about presuppositions. I guess this is were the “Mormon epistemology” kicks in. Seems to permit the manufacture multiple attestation.

    “therefore I cried unto the Lord for mercy for there was none else to whom I could go and obtain mercy and the Lord heard my cry in the wilderness and while in attitude of calling upon the Lord a piller of light above the brightness of the sun at noon day come down from above and rested upon me and I was filled with the spirit of god and the [Lord] opened the heavens upon me and I saw the Lord and he spake unto me saying Joseph thy sins are forgiven thee. go thy walk in my statutes and keep my commandments behold I am the Lord of glory I was crucifyed for the world that all those who believe on my name may have Eternal life

    “Whereof one cannot [handle to historical facts reasonably], thereof one must be silent.”

    [1] He used “probably” in an earlier FAIR interview.

Trackbacks

  1. 31 March 2014 | MormonVoices says:
    March 31, 2014 at 7:42 pm

    […] http://blog.fairlatterdaysaints.org/2014/03/31/mormon-fair-cast-215-the-first-vision/ […]

Primary Sidebar

Subscribe to Blog

Enter your email address:

Delivered by FeedBurner


RSS-Icon RSS Feed (all posts)

Subscribe to Podcast

Podcast icon
Subscribe to podcast in iTunes
Subscribe to podcast elsewhere
Listen with FairMormon app
Android app on Google Play

Pages

  • Blog Guidelines

FairMormon Latest

  • Come Follow Me Week 4: Doctrine and Covenants 3–5
  • Come Follow Me Week Three: The Turning of Hearts
  • Joseph Smith’s First Vision
  • Willing to Be Weak
  • FairMormon Finances

Blog Categories

Recent Comments

  • Shanon Edwards on Come Follow Me Week 4: Doctrine and Covenants 3–5
  • Hogarth on Come Follow Me Week 4: Doctrine and Covenants 3–5
  • Dennis Horne on Come Follow Me Week 4: Doctrine and Covenants 3–5
  • Neal Smith on FAIR Voice Podcast #25: Interview with Blake Ostler
  • Debbi Rollo on Joseph Smith’s First Vision

Archives

Footer

FairMormon Logo

FairMormon is a non-profit organization dedicated to providing well-documented answers to criticisms of the doctrine, practice, and history of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Our Friends

  • Book of Mormon Central
  • BYU Religious Studies Center
  • BYU Studies
  • Interpreter Foundation
  • LDS Perspectives Podcast
  • Pearl of Great Price Central

Follow Us

  • Facebook
  • Twitter
  • iTunes
  • YouTube

Donate to FairMormon

We are a volunteer organization. We invite you to give back.

Donate Now

Donate to us by shopping at Amazon at no extra cost to you. Learn how →

Site Footer

Copyright © 1997-2021 by The Foundation for Apologetic Information and Research, Inc. All Rights Reserved.

No portion of this site may be reproduced without the express written consent of The Foundation for Apologetic Information and Research, Inc.

Any opinions expressed, implied, or included in or with the goods and services offered by FairMormon are solely those of FairMormon and not those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Foundation for Apologetic Information and Research (FAIR) Logo

FairMormon™ is controlled and operated by the Foundation for Apologetic Information and Research (FAIR)